Talk:Robert M. La Follette

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Good articleRobert M. La Follette has been listed as one of the Social sciences and society good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
Article milestones
DateProcessResult
July 11, 2021Good article nomineeNot listed
October 21, 2021Good article nomineeListed
Did You Know
A fact from this article appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the "Did you know?" column on November 16, 2021.
The text of the entry was: Did you know ... that despite contesting the 1924 presidential election as a third-party candidate, Robert M. La Follette (pictured) received approximately 16.6 percent of the popular vote?
Current status: Good article

Vegetarian

This notes that he was vegetarian. This may or may not be relevant but I figure I should note it.

Judge

"La Follette returned to Wisconsin, where he served as a judge. In 1891, he refused a bribe offered by a powerful Wisconsin Republican."

Wasn't it LaFollette's brother that was the judge, not Bob himself?

  • Right. This entry needs serious work. I've started on it, but it needs more.

This is also something from page 454 of McGraw Hill's "U.S. A Narrative History Volume 2: From 1865. Seventh Edition." -- "When a Republican boss offered him a bribe in a railroad case, La Follette pledged to break 'the power of this corrupt influence.' In 1900 he won the governorship of Wisconsin as an uncommonly independent Republican." — Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.73.23.2 (talk) 14:13, 26 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Death

if i am correct, didnt he die on the 18 and not the 20th? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cheevedw (talk • contribs) 02:04, 1 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


pronunciation

how the hell do you pronounce his name--Jaysscholar 22:09, 10 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

  • La Fie Ette Pimpalicious 06:40, 29 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]
    • That's not correct, it's not Lafayette, it is La Follette, La Fall Ette. Pm06420 15:47, 29 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Re: POV

That La Follette is WI's favorite son is hardly controversial. In WI politics, the other biggies were Proxmire, Belle Case La Follette, Father Groppi, Phil and Robert La Follette Jr., Dodge (as in, get out of Dodge), Randall, and Vilas. Oh, and McCarthy. Hands down (do a google) you'll find Fighting Bob is the one. - Manski

Nickname

wasn't it "battling bob"?

>> No. Where did you get that? Definitely Fighting Bob.

your both wrong, he was nicknamed the father of the progressive era. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.101.9.231 (talk) 02:10, 22 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Page 454 of McGraw Hill's "U.S. A Narrative History Volume 2: From 1865. Seventh Edition" calls him "Battle Bob" La Follette. I don't know where they got that from though.

Prohibition, Woman Suffrage

This article would benefit from making La Follette's stands on Prohibition and the other constitutional amendments more explicit. Boris B 05:33, 6 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The playwright George Middleton 1880-1967 son in law

Eventually, an article about the playwright George Middleton will have to be started. George Middleton was married to Fola La Follette and was prominent in his own right. I am working on some notes at home for a possible article. Thank you-RFD 15:12, 10 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

After looking at some of the materials involving the playwright George Middleton, I put a request in for an article. There were lots of plays,other materials, George Middleton wrote and produced. I do know I am not very knowledgable about this type of subject. Thank you-RFD 13:30, 12 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I got the article about George Middleton (playwright) started and it took lots of research and work and overcoming some fears on my part.ThanksRFD 17:30, 14 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Chester La Follette and the 5 Outstanding Senators of 1957

The sentence about Chester La Follette and the Senator's portrait in the US Capitol needs to be move to the paragraph about Senator La Follette being honored as one of the outstanding senators in 1957. The portrait was commissioned for that event. Therefore the 2 items are related and should not be separated.Again my thanksRFD 15:17, 10 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Quote sources

I would like to see clear precise citations for the sources of the quotes that appear in this article. I have seen them various places around the internet, possibly even stitched together in different ways. I would like to see them in their original context, but do not know where to begin looking. -- 136.159.61.8 19:10, 10 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know who put up a "Weasel Words" banner, but that's not appropriate. What IS appropriate is some sort of indicator that this article is not properly footnoted. It's fine to use one source multiple times, but page numbers really do need to be provided for each fact lifted. Carrite (talk) 18:13, 14 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Education

The article says:

> He graduated [from university] in 1879.

> La Follette attended law school briefly and passed the bar in 1880.

> Soon after obtaining his law degree...

My question is this: did he actually graduate from law school? If so, how long was the programme in those days? Or was it possible in Wisconsin, as in other places, to sit the bar exam on the basis of knowledge gained otherwise, e.g., by reading independently and/or studying with a qualified attorney?

The time-frame just seems somewhat compressed. And, if he didn't graduate from law school, then, admitted to the bar or not, he can't be said to have had a law degree.HenryLarsen (talk) 13:12, 9 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The Wisconsin Historical Society article and the Congressional Biography said he read the law and then was admitted to the bar. This happen after he graduated from college. In the 19th century you studied the law with a lawyer and then appear before some lawyers to take an exam. Thank you-RFD (talk) 00:19, 11 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I just look at Senator La Follette's Autobiobraphy. On pg, 4 La Follette read the law with a lawyer last name Bashford and also spent time at law school for 5 months and then was admitted to the bar-Thank you-RFD (talk) 00:26, 11 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

League of Nations

The intro says that the opposed US entry in the League of Nations, but there's not another word about it. I would like to know why. Does anyone know? —75.4.225.234 (talk) 08:34, 25 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 7 December 2017

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: moved as proposed. Consensus is that the Sr. is the primary topic, and Jr. can be linked in a hatnote or searched directly. By the same rationale, Bob La Follette should redirect here, and Robert La Follette moved to Robert M. La Follette (disambiguation). (closed by page mover) Bradv 04:40, 22 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Robert M. La Follette Sr. → Robert M. La Follette – Most sources simply refer to him as Robert M. La Follette without the Sr. designation, including the U.S. Senate website. He was more well-known than his son of the same name and he is the first choice that comes up when you type his name into Google. 2601:241:300:C930:2070:8B2E:92D7:2DE4 (talk) 15:49, 7 December 2017 (UTC) --Relisting. SkyWarrior 19:18, 14 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

  • Support, yes, I would think it's his common and most familiar name. And it seems odd to see the nickname "Fighting Bob" as part of a name which includes "Sr." His son is known as "Young Bob", not "Fighting Bob". And the list of Memorials on his page, and other linked mentions, don't include 'Sr.', and could be a point in favor of this requested change. Randy Kryn (talk) 16:33, 7 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment: I certainly hope that changing the name of the article doesn't result in the changing of his name throughout Wikipedia articles where he's mentioned. Sr. and Jr. were involved in a lot of the same political activities, and I certainly don't want to have to click on every "Robert M. La Follette" link to find out which person is being referred to. 32.218.37.160 (talk) 00:03, 8 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support – sources, including the official U.S. Senate website as well as Britannica among others, refer to the senator as Robert M. La Follette without a suffix, and his son is referred to with the suffix Jr. A hatnote and natural disambiguation should solve any confusion between them. CookieMonster755 𝚨-𝛀 01:27, 9 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment-I agree with 32.218.37.160. I am concern about any confusion that would result from the change. Thank you-RFD (talk) 15:29, 10 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose -- Although I agree with 32.218.37.160 that Sr. is much more well known, I think 32.218.37.160 and RFD are correct in leaving the main pages where they are and keeping the DAB. -- Dolotta (talk) 19:17, 14 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support due to the elder La Follette being the primary topic. However, editors should also consider moving this page to Bob La Follette. Formalities of the Senate notwithstanding, he was commonly known by the shorter name in his lifetime. 64.105.98.115 (talk) 21:04, 14 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
    • Note The Congressional Biography on Robert La Follette listed him as Robert Marion La Follette. And the Wisconsin Blue Book biographical sketches about Robert La Follette when he was Governor of Wisconsin and as United State Senator also listed him as Robert Marion La Follette. He was probably informally called Bob; his son Robert La Follette Jr. was also called Bob. Moving the title to Bob La Follette would only makes this more confusing. Thank you-RFD (talk) 16:14, 15 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

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GA Review

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Robert M. La Follette/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Kncny11 (talk · contribs) 17:29, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]


Hello! I'll be reviewing this article as part of the July 2021 good article nominations backlog drive! Any section that I've marked with a  Working tag means that I haven't finished leaving comments there, but you're free to begin making changes as soon as you see them! Kncny11 (shoot) 17:29, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Good Article review progress box
Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV ()
3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant ()
Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed

Infobox and lede

  • Per WP:LEADCITE, ledes don't normally have citations, but direct quotes should be linked, particularly the one about being "the most celebrated leader in Wisconsin history".

Early life

  • Comma after "in 1862"
  • Specify that he graduated with a Bachelor of Science degree
  • Also specify that the student paper was called the University Press

Early political career

Governor of Wisconsin

Senator

Roosevelt administration

  • Replace parentheses with commas in second sentence
  • "sixteen consecutive" → "16 consecutive" per MOS:NUMBERS

Taft administration

  • "senators except" → "senators except for"
  • Switch the "In consultation with..." and "in January 1911" clauses
  • ""and Wendell Phillips."" → ""and Wendell Phillips"." per MOS:LQ
  • Mention when exactly the autobiography came out, so we can understand how that might have affected the presidential election
  • "would undergo surgery" → "required surgery"

Wilson administration

  • The bit about foreign policy seems tacked on in its current state; if possible, try to expand and split into a different paragraph
  • Replace hyphen with en dash for the 373–50 vote
  • Comma after "After the U.S. declared war"
  • "during 1917 and 1918" → "throughout this period"
  • ""struggling to establish an industrial democracy."" → ""struggling to establish an industrial democracy"." per MOS:LQ

Harding administration

  • "La Follette retained influence in Wisconsin after the war" (or some such time qualifier)
  • Need a reference for the death date of Harding and subsequent succession by Coolidge
  • The last paragraph is a hell of a run-on sentence

1924 Presidential campaign

Death

  • Perhaps worth mentioning that the heart disease was complicated by bronchitis and pneumonia
  • WL to Forest Hill Cemetery (Madison, Wisconsin)
  • Also mention that he was still in office at the time of his death

Legacy

  • Either WL Philip and Robert in the first sentence, or don't mention their names until later
  • ""the most celebrated figure in Wisconsin history."" → ""the most celebrated figure in Wisconsin history"." per MOS:LQ

Memorials

  • Everything after the painting in the Senate is currently unreferenced

References

  • There is currently an awkward split on the Bibliography side, where at first glance it looks like there are no specialty studies. It might be preferable to use column tags rather than reflist tags here
  • On that note, the bibliography section should probably be called "Further reading", as "Bibliography" is usually used for what you have listed as "Works cited"

General comments

  • Broadness, focus, neutrality, and stability all shake out
  • Pictures are available for use and are relevant to the article
  • Mention somewhere in the body how he came by the nickname "Fighting Bob"
  • Include the years in which he was governor and senator in the headers for those respective sections
  • Earwig score looks good at 32.9%, with the higher ones coming from direct, attributed quotes. I also spot checked some of the offline sources.

Great work so far! Mostly just small MOS things and a few silly mistakes that happen with an article of this length. Putting on hold now, and let me know if you have any questions! Kncny11 (shoot) 19:44, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

No changes made to article in over a week. Only activity from user since April has been two RfA votes. Closing this one as a fail, unfortunately. — GhostRiver 01:21, 11 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Citation style

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

I wish to expand this articles, add various expert studies before re-nominating it for GA. But, I would prefer citing sources using Short footnote template. Per WP:CITEVAR, "Editors should not attempt to change an article's established citation style merely on the grounds of personal preference, to make it match other articles, or without first seeking consensus for the change." The current established styles of citation is based on WP:CITESHORT (under <ref>...</ref> tags). Currently, almost half of the article is cited to a single book (Thelen – 1976). Would it be fine to switch to Sfn's? – Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 13:05, 7 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Over 2 months, no comments! Respecting the rules and manual of style, I continue my work on this article in its initial style of referencing. Archiving this now. – Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 14:44, 20 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

GA Review

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Robert M. La Follette/GA2. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Reviewer: GhostRiver (talk · contribs) 01:14, 21 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]


I'll be taking a look at this (again)! I anticipate this review being somewhat quick, as all of the comments from my previous review should have been addressed. — GhostRiver 01:14, 21 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Good Article review progress box
Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV ()
3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant ()
Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed

Lede

Early life

  • "eight monthes" → "eight months"

Early political career

House of Representatives

  • "protege" → "protégé"
  • No comma after "Author Jorn Brøndal wrote that"
  • "hlamed" → "blamed"

Gubernatorial candidate

  • "Democratic opponent – Louis G. Bomrich" → "Democratic opponent Louis G. Bomrich"

Governor of Wisconsin (1901–1906)

  • No comma or space needed after "implementation of primary elections"
  • Comma after "ultimately"
  • "state supreme court" → "state Supreme Court" with a link to Wisconsin Supreme Court

Senator (1906–1925)

Roosevelt administration (1906–1909)

  • Link demagogue
  • Mention some of the progressive measures Roosevelt declined to support
  • "Beginning with the 1908 presidential election" → "Beginning in 1908"

Taft administration (1909–1913)

  • Shift the photos up to the start of this section, purely for aesthetic reasons
  • "sixteen congressmen" → "16 congressmen" per MOS:NUM

Wilson administration (1913–1921)

  • Combine second and third paragraphs
  • "In many people's eyes throughout this period, La Follette was a traitor to his country because he was in effect supporting Germany." → "This earned the ire of many Americans, who believed that La Follette was a traitor to his country, effectively supporting Germany."

Harding–Coolidge administration (1921–1924)

  • "conservative Senator" → "conservative senator" (senator here being used as a descriptor, not a title)
  • Hyphen to en dash in "1920-21"

1924 presidential campaign

  • Either "By early 1924" or "in late 1923" can be excised
  • "quickly endorsed La Follette for president" → "quickly endorsed his presidential bid"
  • "and "Independent."" → "and "Independent"." per MOS:LQ
  • "La Follette's 16.6% showing" → "La Follette's 16.6 percent showing" per MOS:PERCENT

Death and legacy

  • Link bronchitis and pneumonia
  • "offered to his wife –" → "offered to his wife,"
  • "but she didn't accept the offer" → "but she declined the offer"
  • "After his death, La Follette's wife, Belle Case La Follette, remained" → "After her husband's death, Belle Case remained"
  • Link Robert M. La Follette Jr. in the first paragraph and delink in the second
  • "Democratic nominee for Governor of Wisconsin" → "Democratic gubernatorial nominee"

Everything else is already checked and has not been substantially changed! Putting on hold for now to allow nominator to address comments. — GhostRiver 01:40, 21 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@GhostRiver – Thanks a lot for another taking a look. I have addressed all the comments, and have added just 2 more images, both in the public domain. How is it looking now? – Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 09:44, 21 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Everything looks good now, happy to pass! — GhostRiver 13:46, 21 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Theleekycauldron (talk) 10:25, 11 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

(
)
Robert M. La Follette recording a radio speech in 1924, months before his death.
Robert M. La Follette recording a radio speech in 1924, months before his death.
  • ... that Robert M. La Follette (pictured) has been referred to as "Fighting Bob" and "the most celebrated figure in Wisconsin history"? Source: Unger, Nancy C. (2000). Fighting Bob La Follette: The Righteous Reformer. Chapel Hill, North Carolina: The University of North Carolina Press. ISBN 978-0-8078-2545-7; Buenker, John D. (1998). "Robert M. La Follette's Progressive Odyssey". The Wisconsin Magazine of History. 82 (1):30
  • Reviewed the following:

Improved to Good Article status by Kavyansh.Singh (talk). Self-nominated at 14:04, 21 October 2021 (UTC).[reply]

  • Article meets all the criteria, and passes Earwig. The hooks don't blow me away, but ALT2 seems slightly better than the others. Figureofnine (talk • contribs) 20:50, 23 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

ALT2 to T:DYK/P3

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