User talk:Fowlia

Your submission at Articles for creation: RoboLens (July 10)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by Flat Out was: Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved.

• If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:RoboLens and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
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Flat Out (talk) 06:50, 10 July 2015 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Sina (July 22)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted because it included copyrighted information, which is not permitted on Wikipedia. You are welcome to write an article on the subject, but please do not use copyrighted work.

• Draft:Sina may be deleted at any time unless the copied text is removed. Copyrighted work cannot be allowed to remain on Wikipedia.
• If you need any assistance, you can ask for help at the Articles for creation help desk or on the reviewer's talk page.
• You can also get Wikipedia's Live Help real-time chat help from experienced editors.

FoCuSandLeArN (talk) 02:44, 22 July 2015 (UTC)

Hello! Fowlia, I noticed your article was declined at Articles for Creation, and that can be disappointing. If you are wondering or curious about why your article submission was declined please post a question at the Articles for creation help desk. If you have any other questions about your editing experience, we'd love to help you at the Teahouse, a friendly space on Wikipedia where experienced editors lend a hand to help new editors like yourself! See you there! FoCuSandLeArN (talk) 02:44, 22 July 2015 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: RoboLens (July 24)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by Flat Out was: Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved.

• If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:RoboLens and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
• If you need any assistance, you can ask for help at the Articles for creation help desk or on the reviewer's talk page.
• You can also get Wikipedia's Live Help real-time chat help from experienced editors.

Flat Out (talk) 02:33, 24 July 2015 (UTC)

deletion

To donate text to Wikipedia, the simplest way is to label the web page explicitly as public domain. Alternatively, see here. Note that there may be other issues with your text. I noticed, for example, that there was a good deal of bolding. The subject of the article should be bolded at first mention, that's all Jimfbleak - talk to me? 16:07, 25 July 2015 (UTC)

The same copyright issues applies to any images you wish to donate if they have been published elsewhere Jimfbleak - talk to me? 16:09, 25 July 2015 (UTC)

Conflict of interest in Wikipedia

Hi Fowlia. I work on conflict of interest issues in Wikipedia, and on topics related to medical devices and health, generally.

You disclosed here that http://sinamed.ir/sina/ is "one of my websites". I am not sure what the "my" there means - if you are a consultant or employee of Sina who does web work, or if you own Sina, but either way, you have a conflict of interest in Wikipedia with regard to subjects related to Sina - so robotic surgery and cameras. I'm giving you notice of our Conflict of Interest guideline and Terms of Use, and will have some comments and questions for you below.

Hello, Fowlia. We welcome your contributions to Wikipedia, but if you have an external relationship with some of the people, places or things you have written about on Wikipedia, you may have a conflict of interest or close connection to the subject.

All editors are required to comply with Wikipedia's neutral point of view content policy. People who are very close to a subject often have a distorted view of it, which may cause them to inadvertently edit in ways that make the article either too flattering or too disparaging. People with a close connection to a subject are not absolutely prohibited from editing about that subject, but they need to be especially careful about ensuring their edits are verified by reliable sources and writing with as little bias as possible.

If you are very close to a subject, here are some ways you can reduce the risk of problems:

• Avoid or exercise great caution when editing or creating articles related to you, your organization, or its competitors, as well as projects and products they are involved with.
• Avoid linking to the Wikipedia article or website of your organization in other articles (see Wikipedia:Spam).
• Exercise great caution so that you do not accidentally breach Wikipedia's content policies.

Please familiarize yourself with relevant content policies and guidelines, especially those pertaining to neutral point of view, verifiability of information, and autobiographies. Note that Wikipedia's terms of use require disclosure of your employer, client, and affiliation with respect to any contribution for which you receive, or expect to receive, compensation.

For information on how to contribute to Wikipedia when you have a conflict of interest, please see our frequently asked questions for organizations. Thank you.

Comments/questions

Wikipedia is a widely-used reference work and managing conflict of interest is essential for ensuring the integrity of Wikipedia and retaining the public's trust in it. As in academia, COI is managed here in two steps - disclosure and a form of peer review.

DIsclosure is the most important, and first, step. While I am not asking you to disclose your identity (anonymity is strictly protecting by out WP:OUTING policy) would you please disclose your relationship with Sina? After you respond (and you can just reply below), perhaps we can talk a bit about how to disclose that elsewhere in Wikipedia, as well as the "peer review" aspect of things. Thanks!

You can reply here - I am watching this page. Once you do, we can take it from there. Thanks in advance for talking! Jytdog (talk) 19:31, 25 July 2015 (UTC)

Hi , and thanks for your information. What your are talking about is surely logical and I can't deny it is right. As I previously said I'm the owner of "sinamed.ir", I meant that I translated the articles, brochures, press conferences and ... from Persian to English to include them in the website. But I'm not the owner of the company nor I have any profit there. They asked me to upload those materials to Wikipedia and that's why I initiated these articles! I mentioned these because every single thing that I added to Wiki (or Wikipedia Commons) where deleted because of copyright issues. So I wanted to know is there anyway we can resolve this problem? for example emailing Wikipedia the necessary consents form an official account. Or placing an "open source"-like license beneeth each page at "sinamed.ir" and "iamt.tums.ac.it"?

"About conflict of interest: If people asked me about the validity of my sources or what I allege, I could answer them and we would probably find solution for controversial claims in each article. The problem is, the articles are getting rejected by vague reason, like "not enough citation" (even though I included 6 different citations for a 2 paragraph article "robolens" from books and journal articles, some of those written by non-Iranians). So I could not see any possibilty to converse on those possible issues which are fueled by conflict of interest.

I'm eagerly looking forward to hear from you. Thank you! Fowlia (talk) 01:15, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for replying. I understand that you would like to get your articles up. I am here to discuss COI issues with you and while that is ongoing, I don't get involved in content issues, as it gets too messy. Turning back to COI issues... I don't understand your relationship with Sina. You said two things that the relationship is not, but you didn't say what it is. Would you please disclose your relationship with Sina? Thanks. Jytdog (talk) 05:22, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

I'm a M.Sc. student and I work on my thesis at a research center which sells its products through SINA brand. As I had some basic HTML knowledge, they asked me to upload a site for them to introduce some of their products. So I gathered some data from their Papers and Books (even interview in TV) and then translated them, before putting them both on SINA.ir and Wikipedia. Again, I shall thank you for helping me out! Fowlia (talk) 05:48, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for making that more clear. I take it they are paying you for this work, is that right? Jytdog (talk) 06:20, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

No I'm not. As a student I should do what my Thesis' supervisor ask me!

OK, we have arrived at the core of the matter. . Do you see how you are very far from doing this freely, but instead are driven by an interest outside of Wikipedia? That is what creates the conflict of interest. This is not the end of the world. It just needs disclosing and managing, just like in academia.

When you submit a manuscript to a decent, journal, they require you to disclose any COI, right? Same thing here. Disclosure is essential. Now, in academia there are really two levels of peer review before something publishes. First, the journal decides if the paper is a good fit and good enough (that is the first level) and if it is, they send the paper on for actual peer review (that is the second level). Applying that within Wikipedia is pretty straightforward. First, you submit articles through AfC, which you have been doing, and which is great. That is a form of peer review here similar to a journal agreeing to send an article for further review, or sending it back to you. (You should also disclose your COI on the draft article Talk page.... something like: "My master's thesis supervisor is connected to Sira (it would helpful if you clarified how, by the way), and asked me to create this article". If the article gets created, once it is "live" you should not edit the article directly, but instead offer proposals to change the article, on the article on the Talk page, so that independent editors can review them. This is more like normal peer review. I hope that all makes sense.

There is no bar to your continuing to try to get the article created, by the way. But please understand that some subjects to not meet the criteria we have for whether articles can exist or not. It is a pretty objective standard. The general policy for whether an article can exist or not, is WP:NOTABILITY. I suggest you read it carefully. WP:The Golden rule is a good short description of the essence of that policy, by the way. There are guidelines for specific topics. WP:ORG is the guideline describing how we apply NOTABILITY to companies. You may want to read that carefully too. If there are not enough good sources, the article cannot be created by Wikipedia policy; if that is the case, it is not your fault. If you read and understand NOTABILITY and ORG you ~should~ be able to explain that to your supervisor.

Does that all make sense? 08:19, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

Yes I think I understood what you said. To make sure, Can you correct me if I understood wrong? The Procedure that I should follow would be like this:

1- I check the WP:NOTABILITY to make sure that the article worth including in Wikipedia

2- I recreate the page, include general information about subject just like a technical note article

3- Include my COI in the talk page of that certain article

4- wait for other people's review

5- for further changes, I can only propose but not act directly

You nailed it! When you review NOTABILITY (especially its requirement for independent sources that are substantially about the subject of the article, you may decide for yourself that the subject doesn't meet the criteria. And as Jimofbleak was warning you below, be sure not to violate copyright. Note - if the content is pretty much straight from Sina's website the article probably will not pass NOTABILITY - you need independent sourcing. If you want to better understand how the community judges articles, you might want to look at articles that somehow were created but have been nominated for deletion. The process and kinds of arguments are described here: Wikipedia:Deletion_process#Deletion_discussions. The index to the lists of articles up for deletion (we call it AfD "articles for deletion") can be found here: Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion#Current_and_past_Articles_for_deletion_.28AfD.29_discussions. They are indexed by day, so click on any day there to get to the list (there are many many! - this place is like cockroaches with articles being created and deleted like crazy) I suggest you pick an older day so you can see the AfDs with plenty of discussion, so you can see the kinds of arguments that are made... Good luck! And please feel free to ping me if you have any questions. Jytdog (talk) 09:10, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

Thank you a lot! Your help made my day. I will contact you if I had any problem regarding COI, hope not any time soon!

Reply

Hi, thanks for message. You can sign your comments automatically using four tildes ~~~~.

• This robot was unveiled just a month ago, and before that date we, at research center for Biomedical Technologies and Robotics, were forbiden to publish any paper in scientific journals. Articles and technical notes are currently under review in Journals and none of them have been published (yet). different groups are performing clinical and technical evaluations (for example to highlight drawbacks as you said) but these studies are far from finished. What should I do regarding these?— it may be that it's just too soon to write this article yet. We have a similar problem with eg as-yet-unreleased films, which may end up as notable, but can't be established as such before they are released.
• I tried my best to ensure neutral point of view. but to compare it with different system (such as Raven or Da Vinci), I was thinking that after uploading this article to Wikipedia, people can freely add their viewpoint about differences, as tech-specs and design data have been published online and these comparisons are possible.—Well, that's true, but your article needs to be balanced from the word go to survive long enough for development. And people are expected to add facts, not viewpoints or opinions

I appreciate the above doesn't help a great deal, but once the copyright/close paraphrase issue has been addressed, you should be able write something neutral. Personally, I think you would do better to wait until you have third-party refs. Remember to declare your COI on the talk page, transparency is becoming an increasing issue, and some of the medical editors are particularly zealous on enforcing this Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:37, 31 July 2015 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Sina Telesurgery System (August 26)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by Aerospeed was: Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved.

• If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:Sina Telesurgery System and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
• If you need any assistance, you can ask for help at the Articles for creation help desk or on the reviewer's talk page.
• You can also get Wikipedia's Live Help real-time chat help from experienced editors.

Aerospeed (Talk) 15:09, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

Hello! Fowlia, I noticed your article was declined at Articles for Creation, and that can be disappointing. If you are wondering or curious about why your article submission was declined please post a question at the Articles for creation help desk. If you have any other questions about your editing experience, we'd love to help you at the Teahouse, a friendly space on Wikipedia where experienced editors lend a hand to help new editors like yourself! See you there! Aerospeed (Talk) 15:09, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

Draft:RoboLens concern

Hi there, I'm HasteurBot. I just wanted to let you know that Draft:RoboLens, a page you created, has not been edited in 5 months. The Articles for Creation space is not an indefinite storage location for content that is not appropriate for articlespace.

If your submission is not edited soon, it could be nominated for deletion. If you would like to attempt to save it, you will need to improve it.

You may request Userfication of the content if it meets requirements.

If the deletion has already occured, instructions on how you may be able to retrieve it are available at WP:REFUND/G13.

Thank you for your attention. HasteurBot (talk) 02:06, 4 January 2016 (UTC)

Draft:Sina Telesurgery System concern

Hi there, I'm HasteurBot. I just wanted to let you know that Draft:Sina Telesurgery System, a page you created, has not been edited in 5 months. The Articles for Creation space is not an indefinite storage location for content that is not appropriate for articlespace.

If your submission is not edited soon, it could be nominated for deletion. If you would like to attempt to save it, you will need to improve it.

You may request Userfication of the content if it meets requirements.

If the deletion has already occured, instructions on how you may be able to retrieve it are available at WP:REFUND/G13.

Thank you for your attention. HasteurBot (talk) 01:41, 27 January 2016 (UTC)

Your draft article, Draft:RoboLens

Hello, Fowlia. It has been over six months since you last edited your Articles for Creation draft article submission, "RoboLens".

In accordance with our policy that Articles for Creation is not for the indefinite hosting of material deemed unsuitable for the encyclopedia mainspace, the draft has been nominated for deletion. If you plan on working on it further, or editing it to address the issues raised if it was declined, simply and remove the {{db-afc}} or {{db-g13}} code.

If your submission has already been deleted by the time you get there, and you wish to retrieve it, you can request its undeletion by following the instructions at this link. An administrator will, in most cases, restore the submission so you can continue to work on it.

Thanks for your submission to Wikipedia, and happy editing. JMHamo (talk) 23:00, 23 February 2016 (UTC)

Your draft article, Draft:Sina Telesurgery System

Hello, Fowlia. It has been over six months since you last edited your Articles for Creation draft article submission, "Sina Telesurgery System".

In accordance with our policy that Articles for Creation is not for the indefinite hosting of material deemed unsuitable for the encyclopedia mainspace, the draft has been nominated for deletion. If you plan on working on it further, or editing it to address the issues raised if it was declined, simply and remove the {{db-afc}} or {{db-g13}} code.

If your submission has already been deleted by the time you get there, and you wish to retrieve it, you can request its undeletion by following the instructions at this link. An administrator will, in most cases, restore the submission so you can continue to work on it.

Thanks for your submission to Wikipedia, and happy editing. Onel5969 ^{TT me} 20:44, 29 February 2016 (UTC)