Template:Did you know nominations/Czech language

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The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Yoninah (talk) 18:23, 29 November 2014 (UTC)

DYK toolbox

Czech language

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Flag of the Czech Republic

Improved to Good Article status by Tezero (talk). Self nominated at 03:21, 22 September 2014 (UTC).

  • Alternate hook: ... that the Czech language contains a phoneme that does not occur in any other known language? Newyorkbrad (talk) 00:40, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
  • I'd accept that, though I think it'd be more interesting to the reader to specify what it sounds like, especially with a sound file. Tezero (talk) 00:48, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
    • That works for me; I didn't mean to suggest that had to come out. Newyorkbrad (talk) 23:16, 30 September 2014 (UTC)


  • partial review:
  • Timing is fine: the good article listing was made on Sept 20 and the nomination here on Sept 22. The article is more than long enough.
  • The QPQ was completed. The image is free and fine to use small, but in the article it only appears in the infobox. Suggest an image is not needed here.
  • I provided the image in case this is chosen as the primary DYK for its day, in which case it's rather unseemly for there to be no image. If it's not chosen as the primary DYK, an image won't be used anyway. At least I think that's how it works. Tezero (talk) 17:02, 7 November 2014 (UTC)
  • The proposed hooks are within length, neutral and interesting. However, in the article, the citation occurs after the description of the phoneme only, while the part about the phoneme being unique to Czech is in a separate, uncited sentence. Unfortunately, the citation is a book so I can't check if it would be ok to use it for both pieces of information. @Tezero:, do you have the book? Can you check?
  • That sentence isn't uncited. The book confirms both. (Normally, I wouldn't have been surprised if it were uncited, because the GA reviewer moved a bit of text around while reviewing and I know he doesn't care one lick about citations, but in this case I remember seeing it in the book.) The sentence following this, "Notably, it appears in the name Dvořák.", is uncited, but... well, I think it's rather self-explanatory. Tezero (talk) 17:02, 7 November 2014 (UTC)
  • If the hook can be sorted, I am willing to go through and do the paraphrase/copyright check for all the sources I can (there are 108 sources in the article, but most are offline books). 184.147.131.89 (talk) 15:28, 7 November 2014 (UTC)
  • You're welcome to, but I didn't realize that was an expectation for DYK. Tezero (talk) 17:02, 7 November 2014 (UTC)
  • I was pinged on my talk page by 184.147.131.89, so here's my take on a number of issues raised above:
  • Tezero, lead hooks are selected on the basis of images, so hooks without them are simply not placed in the lead position. It's not about a particularly good hook or article, but about the image, possibly more likely to be selected if the underlying article or hook is particularly good. The Czech flag doesn't seem to be particularly apposite here, and it looks a bit odd since the white section just disappears. I'd advise dropping it. If you decide to keep it, a "(pictured)" entry needs to be added to the hook, probably immediately after Czech language link, something like "Czech language (Czech flag pictured)".
  • DYK rules state that all hook facts must be inline cited by the end of the sentence that contains them. This means that the "believed to be unique to Czech" fact needs to be cited at the end of the sentence, even if a subsequent sentence is based on the same source and the citation is there. If "Alternate hook" or "ALT 3" are to be used, the citation needs to be added to that sentence.
  • For DYK reviews, the reviewer is expected to do at least a spot check of the online sources for close paraphrasing and copyvio issues on all nominations. This is true even if a GA review was done; there have been a number of GAs that weren't adequately checked during the GAN. In a few cases, their DYK reviews were delayed while the close paraphrasing was dealt with, and in at least one case, a GAR was opened, and the article ultimately delisted. We don't expect reviewers to go beyond online sources; we typically assume good faith on the offline ones (in the extremely rare event that I happen to have an offline referenced book on my home bookshelves, I'll pull it down and take a look). I frankly can't imagine a DYK reviewer checking 100+ sources, or even 20.
  • Yeah, sorry about that, but a major Eastern European language is a lot to write about. When I'm source-reviewing FACs, I like to spotcheck a few sources picked at random - would someone doing that be sufficient here? Tezero (talk) 22:50, 8 November 2014 (UTC)
  • Creators of hooks can't also review them, which will mean someone other than 184.147.131.89 will have to consider ALT 3. BlueMoonset (talk) 22:25, 8 November 2014 (UTC)
  • Full review needed, since only a partial one has been done thus far by someone who hasn't been editing recently, and we need a new reviewer for ALT3 anyway. Thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 02:51, 21 November 2014 (UTC)

DYK hook ALT 3 verified. (I verified the fact from the hook, for example per [1]) There is no need word "apparently" (I deleted it from the hook). Good to go. --Snek01 (talk) 23:30, 23 November 2014 (UTC)

  • Verifying the hook cite is not a full review. Details that are supposed to be checked in a review can be found at DYK Reviewing guide. Yoninah (talk) 00:14, 26 November 2014 (UTC)
  • OK, I re-checked the hook, article, and everything else seems to be ready for DYK. --Snek01 (talk) 16:38, 28 November 2014 (UTC)
ALT3 has been verified but the fact still lacks an inline citation at the end of the sentence. Please remedy this. Fuebaey (talk) 20:40, 28 November 2014 (UTC)
What? Yes, it does. There isn't one at the end of the following sentence, but that's because it's a trivial fact: all that fact is saying is that a certain letter exists in a certain word. Tezero (talk) 22:21, 28 November 2014 (UTC)
Please correct me if I've missed the citation or I'm pointing at the wrong sentence. Phonology section, start of fourth paragraph: "The phoneme represented by the letter ř (capital Ř) is believed to be unique to Czech." Fuebaey (talk) 10:00, 29 November 2014 (UTC)
Oh, that. Well, the fact is spread over two sentences - that and the next one - and the citation at the end of the next one covers them both. The sentence after that is the one that's uncited. Tezero (talk) 14:29, 29 November 2014 (UTC)
No one is stating that the fact is unreferenced, but the fact needs an inline cite at the end of its sentence per criteria 3b) irregardless of whether the next fact also uses the same citation. Two other editors have already highlighted this point above. Fuebaey (talk) 15:36, 29 November 2014 (UTC)
What I took from it was that the fact was unreferenced - you'll have to forgive me, but "uncited" is synonymous to me - but I've now added one after the first sentence as well. Tezero (talk) 16:25, 29 November 2014 (UTC)
No worries, I did come around intending to promote this but I guess I'll have to make do with restoring the tick. Fuebaey (talk) 16:53, 29 November 2014 (UTC)
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