Talk:Michael Nyman

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Heritage

Should we mention Nyman's heritage? I had always assumed he was of Scandinavian heritage (as his name is common in Sweden), but it turns out his grandparents were Ashkenazic Polish immigrants in Whitechapel, London. It's interesting and might explain some of his works on Jewish themes. Badagnani 15:02, 19 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

At one point I mentioned, citing Pwyll ap Sion, that Nyman's family were Jewish fur assemblers. This appears to have been deleted for unknown reasons.--Scottandrewhutchins (talk) 02:25, 2 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Scott, see this and the section #Faulty information inserted by user Halaster below – no idea where Helge got the idea from that the part was inserted by Halaster, since it was obviously you, and – as you correctly point out – it was properly cited, as well. --Florian Blaschke (talk) 20:51, 14 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

British/English?

In the opening paragraph why is Nyman said to be English but Greenaway British? This seems an odd juxtaposition.

Hefeltsmart 11:24, 4 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Infobox

I have deleted the infobox in view of policy that these are not to be used on composer pages (see Composer Project section 6.1 and Opera Project section 16). Thank you for your cooperation. --Kleinzach 13:41, 6 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I see User:Pigsonthewing has reverted the deletion of the infobox. Looking at the history I see the infobox was deleted on 30 April and then immediately reverted as here by Pigsonthewing, the same user. Is this another disruptive WP:POINT attack? --Kleinzach 13:50, 6 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
No. And there is no such "policy". HTH. Andy Mabbett 13:55, 6 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The members of the Composers Project and the Opera Project have discussed this question, reached a conclusion and put policy statements on their project pages. What else don't you believe? That the earth is round? That the solar system revolves round the sun? --Kleinzach 00:20, 7 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Mind your tone, please. The project members you refer to do not, on their own, have a remit to create policy and do not WP:OWN this page, nor any other set of pages. Andy Mabbett 09:07, 7 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
One of the functions of a project is to discuss issues and then resolve them. This happened in this case. --Kleinzach 05:36, 11 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
They do not set Wikipedia policy. Andy Mabbett 07:43, 11 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I don't understand what you are trying to say. Please explain with references and examples. --Kleinzach 10:53, 11 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
No; that's asking me to prove a negative; if you think they do set policies, please provide evidence. Andy Mabbett 19:57, 13 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I think what people would like to know is, what would adding the infobox here do that makes it valuable? (anti-infobox) -- Myke Cuthbert 16:49, 13 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The same as everywhere else; this has been discussed previously. Andy Mabbett 19:56, 13 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Eh? You haven't answered a single objection that's been raised against the use of composer bioboxes. (This was a particularly ludicrous infobox. Why list his wife and kids? Is this Hello magazine?). --Folantin 20:08, 13 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, I was removing the box because it didn't have enough information, you know, pets, favorite color, etc. In all seriousness, according to the infobox, he's a minimalist composer. Anywhere on the page actually assert what that means in his case? There's no reference to his musical style, and much of his more recent work could be called non-minimalist. How does this box improve the article? The lede also mentions that he's a librettist and a musicologist. Why are these in the lede but not in the box? How does the box assert what is important about his career and what is not? --Myke Cuthbert 20:30, 13 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
"You haven't answered a single objection that's been raised against the use of composer bioboxes." - That is totally untrue; and even if it were true; irrelevant. Andy Mabbett 20:34, 13 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Because User:Pigsonthewing is insisting that consensus be established on each article's talk page, I'll add my voice to Kleinzach, Mscuthbert, and Folantin's position that the infobox should not be used here for all the usual reasons. Fireplace 20:37, 13 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Importance in contemporary music

I would argue that Nyman is of low importance in contemporary music but that in different project he could be top. Hyacinth (talk) 01:41, 16 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I disagree. I think he should be considered at least Mid. There are much more obscure composers than Nyman already classed as Mid. As film composers go, he's seen as pretty far off in left field, so he wouldn't be top there. --Scottandrewhutchins (talk) 15:29, 16 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]
The bolding of titles that should be in italics is unnecessary and looks like the work of a fan or a member of Nyman's staff. It should be corrected. --Wetman (talk) 21:47, 15 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Composer project review

I've reviewed this article as part of the Composers project review of its B-class articles. I find this article to be an extremely weak B. It is largely a promotional piece, good for his fans. It is short on some encyclopedic information that is typical of other composers (even living ones; see for example Pierre Boulez or Philip Glass, although those articles, like this one, are also short on personal information). My detailed comments are on the comments page; questions or comments can be left here or on my talk page. Magic♪piano 14:29, 11 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Biography & Personal life

Wouldn't personal life be part of biography and thus merged? Hyacinth (talk) 19:16, 26 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The 1st paragraph of 'Personal life' (about Nyman's wife and daughter)is relevant to his music.so that material should be merged into 'Biography'. And why not completely remove the 2nd paragraph of 'Personal life'?. Scurrilous gossip is not appropriate to an encyclopaedia article. Whether or not it can be verified, is neither here nor there. 2ndBass 02:00, 20 February 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 2ndBass (talk • contribs)

Faulty information inserted by user Halaster

I removed a section that was most likely plainly wrong. User Halaster has added a lot of stuff that are probably lies. See the history. --HelgeStenstrom (talk) 16:43, 10 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Waybuloo

The BBC children's TV programme Waybuloo has a soundtrack that sounds like it is either by, or heavily influenced by, Nyman - notably his Peter Greenaway film scores. So similar that I'm wondering whether he actually scored Waybuloo; if true can anyone provide details please? Andrew Oakley (talk) 17:11, 15 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Jane Slavin - Not Noteworthy

While it's an interesting story, Michael Nyman's issues with Jane Slavin does not seem to be particularly noteworthy and thus not deserving of a paragraph all its own. Khono (talk) 17:30, 20 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Page has multiple issues; attention would be a good idea

I've added some comments in my most recent edit. There's a fair bit of stuff that ought to be removed outright, reading as advertising or original research, and some duplication between biography and works list. Most of the issues expressed in the 2008 evaluation seem to be still present, as well. Temevorn 02:27, 2 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Works

Why is the Piano soundtrack missing in the list of works? Tomas —Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.80.86.218 (talk) 18:41, 5 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Originally the works list was kept distinct from the filmography, and it looks like whoever combined them didn't include it.--Scottandrewhutchins (talk) 02:28, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Wife's surname

I'm sure her surname isn't Nyman.Barbara Touburg (talk) 17:05, 20 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Michael Nyman/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

Comment(s)Press [show] to view →
;Composers Project Assessment of Michael Nyman – 2008-12-11

This is an assessment of article Michael Nyman by a member of the Composers project, according to its assessment criteria. This review was done by Magicpiano.

If an article is well-cited, the reviewer is assuming that the article reflects reasonably current scholarship, and deficiencies in the historical record that are documented in a particular area will be appropriately scored. If insufficient inline citations are present, the reviewer will assume that deficiencies in that area may be cured, and that area may be scored down.

Adherence to overall Wikipedia standards (WP:MOS, WP:WIAGA, WP:WIAFA) are the reviewer's opinion, and are not a substitute for the Wikipedia's processes for awarding Good Article or Featured Article status.

Origins/family background/studies

Does the article reflect what is known about the composer's background and childhood? If s/he received musical training as a child, who from, is the experience and nature of the early teachers' influences described?

  • ok
Early career

Does the article indicate when s/he started composing, discuss early style, success/failure? Are other pedagogic and personal influences from this time on his/her music discussed?

  • we don't know what his early compositions were like; no personal details; unclear how he makes money
Mature career

Does the article discuss his/her adult life and composition history? Are other pedagogic and personal influences from this time on his/her music discussed?

  • few personal details; is composing and touring his only occupation?
List(s) of works

Are lists of the composer's works in WP, linked from this article? If there are special catalogs (e.g. Köchel for Mozart, Hoboken for Haydn), are they used? If the composer has written more than 20-30 works, any exhaustive listing should be placed in a separate article.

  • List is claimed to be incomplete; should be split off due to length
Critical appreciation

Does the article discuss his/her style, reception by critics and the public (both during his/her life, and over time)?

  • No critical appreciation or indications of popular reception
Illustrations and sound clips

Does the article contain images of its subject, birthplace, gravesite or other memorials, important residences, manuscript pages, museums, etc? Does it contain samples of the composer's work (as composer and/or performer, if appropriate)? (Note that since many 20th-century works are copyrighted, it may not be possible to acquire more than brief fair use samples of those works, but efforts should be made to do so.) If an article is of high enough quality, do its images and media comply with image use policy and non-free content policy? (Adherence to these is needed for Good Article or Featured Article consideration, and is apparently a common reason for nominations being quick-failed.)

  • Article has images, all poorly-captioned (permission-granted) press shots
References, sources and bibliography

Does the article contain a suitable number of references? Does it contain sufficient inline citations? (For an article to pass Good Article nomination, every paragraph possibly excepting those in the lead, and every direct quotation, should have at least one footnote.) If appropriate, does it include Further Reading or Bibliography beyond the cited references?

  • No references; few inline citations.
Structure and compliance with WP
MOS

Does the article comply with Wikipedia style and layout guidelines, especially WP:MOS, WP:LEAD, WP:LAYOUT, and possibly WP:SIZE? (Article length is not generally significant, although Featured Articles Candidates may be questioned for excessive length.)

  • lead is arguably short
Things that may be necessary to pass a Good Article review
  • Article requires more inline citations (WP:CITE)
  • Article needs (better) images and/or other media (MOS:IMAGE)
Summary

This article reads like a combination fan and promotional biography. Beyond his early years, the entire focus is on his composing and performance activities. There is a small section sketching key personal details; we don't know things like:

  • when he got married
  • was is wife influential in his music
  • did he write music for his children
  • were any other friends influential in his music

There are no significant statements about how private he is with his personal life; in their absence, I assume such information can eventually be provided.

We get a lot of information about his works, and where/when he performed. We do not know if what his primary method is of earning a living. Is it royalties, performing, commissions (from whom, if not movie scores), teaching (where?)?

All of these deficiencies are hallmarks of promotional biographies.

His works list is acknowledged to be incomplete. It is also already lengthy enough that it should be in its own article. Other structural deficiencies include a relative lack of references and inline citations. Living persons bios should more thoroughly cited. The images provided all appear to be recent publicity images, and are poorly captioned (they are not dated, so we don't know how recent they are); a better variety (including candids) would be an improvement.

Article is a weak B; the content present is sufficient to prop it up. Magic♪piano 14:20, 11 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Last edited at 13:55, 2 May 2011 (UTC). Substituted at 23:54, 29 April 2016 (UTC)

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Der Traum der roten Kammer - Ballet

Ballett Dortmund's premiere of "Der Traum der roten Kammer" by Xin Peng Wang with music by Michael Nyman was in November 2012, it was revived in February 2024. I cannot find a reference to this in Wikipedia, or in www.michaelnyman.com . See: https://www.theaterdo.de/produktionen/detail/der-traum-der-roten-kammer/216.120.189.9 (talk) 14:25, 17 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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