Talk:Mar Thoma Syrian Church

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Constant Biased Editing by one User

I really want to revert back to the changes that I made. However accepting Wikipedia policy of consensus, I would like to put down some points

Quoting WP:SCHOLARSHIP, the best reliability is to the quote 2nd party publicly published sources. If that is the case, then the term "Eastern Protestant" itself is wrong and it seems to be a name that was formed in Wikipedia alone. I understand "Reformed Syrian" or "Independent" or as the World Council of Churches provides "Mar Thoma Confessional Tradition".


The next point I would like to make is that this article is not precise and clear. It look like a lot of wanted and unwanted information has been piled together. For example the census in the lead section. What is the purpose of that? This census is not seen in any other church pages from the same geographical location.

Transgender ordination: Is the concept of present day transgenderism and the connection made by one of the prelates to Philip and the Eunuch the same? That being said, has the church officially given a statement anywhere regarding the same? There are many bishops in the Roman Catholic Church and other Apostolic Churches who support LGBTQ+ marriages, does that make it official. If the editors want it to continue there, then it must be made clear that these are just opinions and not official decisions.


If the other users are in consensus, I would like to continue to make this page better based on reliable sources (which may or may not be available online) and provide a better interpretation than the present confusing one. Randomscholar1996 (talk) 04:08, 10 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Titling a section Constant Biased Editing by one User is really not conducive to conversation. Similarly, not citing the problematic diffs or your sources for desired changes in such a comment are also not helpful. ~ Pbritti (talk) 06:23, 10 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@Pbritti You haven't answered my questions. Don't mind the title. Randomscholar1996 (talk) 02:10, 12 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The weakness of your WCC source has already been exposed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Marthoma Family of Churches. In that discussion, you will also find examples of reliably published, scholarly sources; which unlike the WCC, do not merely report the self-proclaimed assertions of its member churches. All those sources classify the Mar Thoma Church as Anglican/Protestant. As a result, your WCC source, as well as the article Marthoma Family of Churches, which was created based on that source, were dismissed and the article converted to a mere redirect to all Saint Thomas Christian denominations. The Protestant aspects of the Mar Thoma Church are already explained here, with sources.--Macinderum (talk) 05:03, 13 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Correct classification and orientation

For more than three years the MTSC has been classified in this article as "Reformed" hyperlinked to Protestant. Although sources attributable to the MTSC or its affiliates prefer the term Reformed to Protestant, reliably published independent sources explicitly use the term “Protestant”. Furthermore, the term "Reformed" could easily be misconstrued as Calvinist. The founding influence that led to the formation of the MTSC was Anglican and not Calvinist. As per reliable sources the Mar Thoma Reformation was modelled after the English Reformation. The Protestant aspects of the Mar Thoma Church were derived from low church Anglicanism, due to contact with missionaries of the Church Mission Society in colonial India. Anglican hymns are an integral part of Mar Thoma worship (Exhibit1). The MTSC is also in full communion with the Anglican Communion. Therefore, removed the text that reads "Reformed" and left the classification as Protestant. The Protestant branch is surely large and diverse enough to accommodate an Oriental Protestant church like the MTSC. Additionally, changed orientation from all-inclusive Protestant to Anglican. Reliable and verifiable sources have been added to substantiate changes.--Macinderum (talk) 12:12, 15 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Mar Thoma church is not a protestant church. 1.159.5.178 (talk) 03:32, 16 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 26 December 2023

Add new bishops in Metropolitans and bishops Zacharias Mar Aprem[1] Joseph Mar Ivanios[2] Mathews Mar Seraphim[3] Joleoooo (talk) 14:06, 26 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

 Not done: It's not clear where this is to be added.  Spintendo  04:55, 28 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ https://marthoma.in/bishop/rt-rev-zacharias-mar-aprem-episcopa/
  2. ^ https://marthoma.in/bishop/rt-rev-joseph-mar-ivanios-episcopa/
  3. ^ https://marthoma.in/bishop/rt-rev-mathews-mar-seraphim-episcopa/

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 19 February 2024

More neutral language needs to be used when talking about "The Emergency" of the 70's. Chackodaniel337 (talk) 05:57, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Cannolis (talk) 06:29, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 13 March 2024

The Church is neither a protestant Church of the western type nor an orthodox church of the eastern type. It is oriental in worship, autonomous in administration and missionary in action. The Church follows an orthodox (true worship) liturgy and a catholic (to all, for all) mission and evangelism. The faith of Marthoma syrian church is reformed orthodox and not protestant accepted christology is miaphysitism.

https://www.abudhabimarthomachurch.com/marthoma_history#:~:text=The%20Church%20is%20neither%20a,for%20all)%20mission%20and%20evangelism.

https://www.brisbanemarthomachurch.org.au/mar-thoma-history/

The Mar Thoma Church Heritage and Mission by Most Rev. Dr. Alexander Mar Thoma Metropolitan

The Faith and Practice of the Mar Thoma Church by Rev. Dr. K. V. Mathew

The Mar Thoma Church, A study of Its Growth and Contribution by Rev. Dr. K. T. Joy 1653.r.1912.m.1934.r (talk) 18:11, 13 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Not done. @1653.r.1912.m.1934.r: It is not immediately clear what you want changed. If you wish for the article not to identify the church as a Protestant denomination, we can't do that. There is firm academic consensus that this is a denomination that falls within the scope of Eastern Protestant Christianity. ~ Pbritti (talk) 18:32, 13 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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