Talk:List of Latin phrases (N)

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Nomen mysticum was nominated for deletion. The discussion was closed on 29 March 2023 with a consensus to merge. Its contents were merged into List of Latin phrases (N). The original page is now a redirect to this page. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected article, please see its history; for its talk page, see here.

ne sutor ultra crepidam

Can I suggest to the maintainers that this be moved to "sutor, ne ultra crepidam" which is how it's generally quoted (so that people may find it looking under 'S' for sutor)? I've linked it to the Wiki on Sutor, ne ultra crepidam, currently the subject of a deletion poll which I hope you will take the trouble to vote to 'keep' as it's a notable and celebrated saying which has always been popular and is still quoted today - thus Philip Howard's Lost Words: ultracrepidarian Rinpoche (talk) 00:17, 10 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Regarding non diligere Deum, qui mandata eius participando cum perfidis non custodit

Regarding "non diligere Deum, qui mandata eius participando cum perfidis non custodit" as "God does not love those who allow perfidy."

This is not the correct translation of this phrase, nor is it even the complete phrase. The full quote, from a transcription ^[1] of the original letter from Pope John VIII writing to Athanasius II of Naples is "Probatur igitur germanus tuus non diligere deum, qui mandata eius, participando cum perfidis, non custodit."; which could be more accurately translated as, "Your brother is proven therefore not to love God, who, sharing with infidels, does not keep His commandments." The 'brother' in this case is Athanasius' brother Sergius II who, while Duke of Naples, maintained friendly relations with the Aghlabid Arabs ^[2], and was later deposed ^[3]. The 'commandments' reference the letter's ^[4] quotation of John 8:47 ^[5] and John 8:51 ^[6].

Where does this translation even come from? Grammatically, God is not the subject. No word or concept even remotely refers to allowing anything. I am sad for anyone who got this tattooed on themselves.

If this analysis is incorrect, at least add a proper citation with English translation for this phrase when the change is reverted.

References

^ Epistolae decretales summorum pontificum. Ferrarius. 1591. pp. 290–.
^ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sergius_II_of_Naples
^ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athanasius_of_Naples
^ Epistolae decretales summorum pontificum. Ferrarius. 1591. pp. 290–.
^ https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Bible_(American_Standard)/John#8:47
^ https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Bible_(American_Standard)/John#8:51

[1] Epistolae decretales summorum pontificum. Ferrarius. 1591. pp. 290–.

[2] ttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sergius_II_of_Naples

[3] ttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athanasius_of_Naples

[4] Epistolae decretales summorum pontificum. Ferrarius. 1591. pp. 290–.

[5] ttps://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Bible_(American_Standard)/John#8:47

[6] ttps://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Bible_(American_Standard)/John#8:51

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Talk:List of Latin phrases (N)

ne sutor ultra crepidam

Regarding non diligere Deum, qui mandata eius participando cum perfidis non custodit

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