Talk:Hestia

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 29 March 2021 and 11 June 2021. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): JLW546. Peer reviewers: Annika.Nicholas, MagpieMeadows.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 22:19, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 13 January 2020 and 20 April 2020. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Lunajb.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 23:24, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

How there is no "biography" for Hestia

what about her her life a a kid what happen (anon1)

Agreed. I added stub as this page needs a bit more. As well as the above, there needs to be some elaboration on the donkey story, or at the least a link to a page about it. (anon2)

No childhoods were imagined for Hestia, just as the Old Man of the Sea was never the "Young Boy of the Sea". Greek gods are manifest in episodes called epiphanies, which may be strung together by a storyteller (Thomas Bulfinch's parlor mythology, I bet) to give a simulation of a "biography", one that is artificial and misleading: it leads to naive questions, like "What about her life a a kid?" Zeus has a childhood set-scene, in a cave on Crete; in the "next" epiphany he overthrows Cronus. There is no "biography" in between. Understanding this is essential for a first approach to Greek myth. This really shouldn't sound "new" to any educated person. --Wetman 03:59, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Virgins

No public cult? What about the Hestian/Vestal Virgins? Or do they count as something else entirely?

Sister of God known as Steven C. Mackey

No public cult of Hestia: i.e. no Greek Hestaion in which she was publicly worshipped. The implied equation Hestia=Vesta is a false equation. Vesta is only a Roman analogy of Hestia. Vesta tends the public hearth at the center of Rome. There is no equivalent in a Greek demos or polis. --Wetman 03:59, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Actually, Hestia tends the public hearth in the prytaneion (e.g. Pindar Nemean 11, 1-6). Jastrow (Λέγετε) 20:03, 3 October 2009 (UTC)

---

The following anecdote concerns the nymph Lotis in Ovid's Fasti (6.319ff) and does not concern Hestia, who does not leave hearths, thus has been moved here: "Only once was Hestia in danger of losing her virginity. After a great feast when the immortals were all either passed out drunk or asleep (Hestia was the latter), Aphrodite and Dionysus' son Priapus---who had grotesquely large genatalia---spied her and was filled with lust for her. He quietly approached the goddess and began to lower himself down on top of her, but the braying of an ass awoke Hestia just in time. She screamed at the sight and Priapus immediately ran away." Click here for original Ovid text) --Wetman 15:17, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Its an odd passage, Ovid's Fasti contains a duplication of the story, in one passage it is the Nymph Lotis in the role, in the other the goddess Hestia. Presumably Ovid drew from some Greek source: although all the components (Priapos, Mt Ida, Cybelian orgies) would suggest it was an indigeneous Mysian myth. Hestia seems quite out of place in the story. If its ever reincluding in the article, it should be with a proviso. --Theranos 20:43, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

interesting: a different perspective Hestia Esti here- http://www.sacred-texts.com/cla/plato/cratylus.htm most interesting

"Her. I think, Socrates, that you are quite right, and I would like to do as you say.

Soc. Shall we begin, then, with Hestia, according to custom?

Her. Yes, that will be very proper.

Soc. What may we suppose him to have meant who gave the name Hestia?

Her. That is another and certainly a most difficult question.

Soc. My dear Hermogenes, the first imposers of names must surely have been considerable persons; they were philosophers, and had a good deal to say.

Her. Well, and what of them?

Soc. They are the men to whom I should attribute the imposition of names. Even in foreign names, if you analyze them, a meaning is still discernible. For example, that which we term ousia is by some called esia, and by others again osia. Now that the essence of things should be called estia, which is akin to the first of these (esia = estia), is rational enough. And there is reason in the Athenians calling that estia which participates in ousia. For in ancient times we too seem to have said esia for ousia, and this you may note to have been the idea of those who appointed that sacrifices should be first offered to estia, which was natural enough if they meant that estia was the essence of things. Those again who read osia seem to have inclined to the opinion of Heracleitus, that all things flow and nothing stands; with them the pushing principle (othoun) is the cause and ruling power of all things, and is therefore rightly called osia. Enough of this, which is all that we who know nothing can affirm. Next in order after Hestia we ought to consider Rhea and Cronos, although the name of Cronos has been already discussed. But I dare say that I am talking great nonsense.

Her. Why, Socrates?

Soc. My good friend, I have discovered a hive of wisdom." —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.96.185.209 (talk) 15:00, 20 November 2008 (UTC)

Speculative origins

I have removed the following text from the article which is too speculative for an encyclopedia entry. There is no evidence of such a direct evolution. --Theranos 20:43, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

And her 2 greatest attributes, that of "Goddess of the Home" and "Goddess of the Hearth/fire" could well originate hundreds of thousands of years ago; ancient cavemen learned fire and stayed in caves to keep warm and safe, and always drew Female Divine images on the cave walls. This probably evolved in Greece to the deity called Hestia.

PLEASE ANSWER!! What do people think of her? Do they like or dislike her?

What was her greatest accoplishment? What was her greatest failure?

Possible vandalism.

Someone should check this edit, it looks suspicious. · AndonicO ^Talk 09:05, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

Looks good to me. What's wrong with it in your point of view? MelancholyPanda (talk) 19:18, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

introduction?

the third paragraph of the introduction:

The hearth fire of a really really really Greek or a Roman household was not allowed to go out, unless it was ritually extinguished and ritually renewed, accompanied by impressive rituals of completion, purification and renewal. Compare the rituals and connotations of an eternal flame and of sanctuary lamps.

the three reallies seem redundant, are they necessary, are any? is this copied from a source or something or can it be pared down? Theneongreensage (talk) 02:30, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

Grammar

I've found two MAJOR grammar mistakes in reading this. First, found in the opening paragraph, is the sentence "Compare the rituals and connotations of an eternal flame and of sanctuary lamps." Is this sentence addressed to the reader, because that would be very inappropriate. The second sentence I've found is under Leaving Olympus where it explains that Dionysus took the seat of Hestia on Olympus. The final sentence in that paragraph says, "She was very grateful for him doing such a thing." Who is the him in this sentence? It is either Zeus or Dionysus, but that is very unclear. I have no idea how to fix these mistakes, but it would be amazing if somebody could. Thanks, Helixer (talk) 03:31, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

The first "mistake" is not one of grammar, but of style, and it's arguable whether it's a problem or not. The second "mistake" is again not a problem of grammar (the sentence is perfectly grammatical), but of clarity--it's not obvious whether Zeus or Dionysus is the antecedent of the pronoun "him".

Sorry to be so pedantic, but I don't like seeing every instance of poor writing being called a grammar mistake. To fix the second problem you identified, I simply deleted the sentence--it didn't seem to add anything useful to the article. --Akhilleus (talk) 03:53, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

Oh, sorry. I just wasn't sure how to call it a mistake to do with the sentence. Should the first sentence maybe be put in parentheses? It doesn't flow well with the rest of the paragraph and really, it's not something pertaining to Hestia; it's more of a side note for people who are interested. Helixer (talk) 19:19, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

Zeus's Head?

Why did Hestia swear on Zeus's head instead of on Styx? We should be able to find an explanation for this, because I know a number of people who are struggling over this one. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.239.149.151 (talk) 18:01, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

Replaced by Dionysus?

The text about Hestia's place being taken by Dionysus has been in the article as long as I can remember. What author makes this observation? Where is Hestia ever specifically placed at Olympus, aside from "all the gods" passing references? --Wetman (talk) 17:23, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

Re Hestia in Olympus, see Plato’Phaedrus 247a, about the procession of the gods: "[Zeus] is followed by an army of gods and spirits, arrayed in eleven squadrons; Hestia alone remains in the house of the god". I don't know about Dionysos, though. Jastrow (Λέγετε) 20:13, 3 October 2009 (UTC)

Comment and question

This article could be expanded and improved. I have a comment and a question.

1. The article says that "Hestia gave up her seat in favor of newcomer Dionysus to tend to the sacred fire on Mount Olympus. However, there is no ancient source for this claim." Then the article says "This nature is illustrated by her giving up her seat in the Olympian twelve to prevent conflict." These sentences are contradicting each other.

2. "Poseidon, and Apollo of the younger generation, each aspired to court Hestia, but the goddess was unmoved by Aphrodite's works and swore on the head of Zeus to retain her virginity." What's the source for this?

ICE77 (talk) 23:23, 18 April 2011 (UTC)

Re #2, the only source is the Homeric hymn to Aphrodite 24-25. Jastrow (Λέγετε) 18:42, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

Information needs cleanup

I'm moving this text from the main article to here, since I don't know how to substantiate it:

Throughout time, rarely, there have been cases of communication and interference with ones mind and mortal soul, preventing the mortal from falling into the depths and grasps of the King of death "hades". Hestia is known for her love and care, this is believed to be the explanation for these "communications, it's said that Hestia takes the role or figure of a loved one to voice her concern in order to make the victim listen. Hestia it's believed that the letters (known nowadays) as, c, e, a, y and k were somewhat symbolic to her beliefs and causes.

I'm sure the author had the very best of intentions, but at the least this needs some NPOV-ing to remove the New Age slant and an academic source. --Roman à clef (talk) 06:57, 3 June 2013 (UTC)

Etymology?

I noticed when viewing the greek goddess Athena's page that she has a whole large section devoted to Etymology of her name. Why is there no etymology section for Hestia? Rrrof711 (talk) 06:27, 30 June 2016 (UTC)

The inclusion (or otherwise) of an etymology section is not determined by policy, topic area or category. It's an editorial choice. Evidently, someone thought it worthwhile to create Athena's etymology section, because a fair amount has been written on the topic: though now I look at it, not enough to merit inclusion in the section title - the section covers cult origins, rather than etymology. Anyhow, I doubt that the single short line explaining Hestia's name origin as "hearth" merits its own section. Haploidavey (talk) 13:17, 30 June 2016 (UTC)

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Revising for Class Project

Hi! In the course of the next couple of weeks, I will be working on this article as an assignment for a technical editing course. As I go, I plan to put any ideas in my sandbox before I make any changes. The main focus of these changes will be the structural organization of the article, and I will likely not change any of the existing content. Thanks!Lunajb (talk) 17:40, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

Changes

Currently, the changes that I have made are all structural. The purpose of these structural changes focus on making the article similar to other goddess pages, such as Aphrodite and Athena. I also wanted to make broader sections so that there is space for information to be added later. Lunajb (talk) 06:30, 23 March 2020 (UTC)

Cult of would-be lovers?

Is there any cult those of us who blaspheme Aphrodite? 2601:647:4D00:2C40:4C9F:787A:E976:E194 (talk) 23:00, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Equivocal or Equivalent?

Status and attributes section: "Hestia's Olympian status is equivocal to her status among men." I struggle to understand how Hestia's Olympian status is ambiguous "to her status among men"... or even what that statement means. It seems far more likely that this editor's intention was that her status is equivalent or analogous, and that this is simply a case of mistaken word choice, and the intention here is to say that "Hestia's status among the Olympians is as ambiguous as it is among men." Anybody else? rowley (talk) 22:16, 31 December 2021 (UTC)

The whole sentence reads as redundant and meaningless, whether or not one "corrects" equivocal to equivalent. It's unsourced, so I've taken it out. Hestia's status is not ambiguous, just a bit complicated, sometimes and in some places. Haploidavey (talk) 22:44, 31 December 2021 (UTC)

I've had a sweep through the article history. Originally, the sentence in question stated that Hestia's status as an Olympian was equivocal. I think I might even have written it. Thanks to a WikiEdu project, a student added the rest (the "to her status among men". Eeeek. Here's the diff [1] But none of it's needed. Haploidavey (talk) 23:12, 31 December 2021 (UTC)

""Virgin goddess"" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect "Virgin goddess" has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 November 12 § "Virgin goddess" until a consensus is reached. TNstingray (talk) 21:06, 12 November 2023 (UTC)

"Virgin goddess" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Virgin goddess has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 November 12 § Virgin goddess until a consensus is reached. TNstingray (talk) 21:11, 12 November 2023 (UTC)

Bibliography

Perhaps you would be interested in adding the following items to the bibliography: Konstantinou, A. (2016) ‘Hestia and Eos: Mapping female mobility and sexuality in Greek mythic thought’, American Journal of Philology 137: 1–24. Konstantinou, A. (2018) Female Mobility and Gendered Space in Ancient Greek Myth, London: Bloomsbury Academic: 28-34. Simon, E. (2021) The Gods of the Greeks, ed. A. Shapiro, trans. Jakob Zeyl, Madison: University of Wisconsin Press: 121-133. 77.137.129.221 (talk) 09:14, 3 December 2023 (UTC)